Comments on: Impressions of PAX 2009

By: SsandmanN

SsandmanN — Thu, 10 Sep 2009 06:48:47 +0000

No doubt about that.
But if you absolutely want to incorporate some story in your game, perhaps the voiceover narrator would be best, as it leaves the player free to go about his business. I was comparing it to written WoW quests, where you have to stand still to read, and to cutscenes, where you don’t have control of your character as well.
If the player doesn’t want to get involved in the story – nothing you can do about that. Question is how to incorporate your story in the least intrusive to the player way, so that whoever is interested could soak it up without boring the rest of the audience.
Perhaps you could do it by leaving text notes that could be read without standing still – something like Warhammer, but still not many players could read some text and play the game at the same time. It seems to me that sound is the perfect medium to convey the message

On a side note, I absolutely love the AION quest tracker and search system. They couldn’t have done it any better.

By: Wolfshead

Wolfshead — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 20:33:40 +0000

Here’s a good article on the upcoming LOTRO Mirkwood expansion:

http://www.massively.com/2009/09/08/pax-2009-turbine-tells-us-all-about-siege-of-mirkwood/

By: Tesh

Tesh — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 19:24:28 +0000

That sort of “short voiceover” narration works pretty well in DDO. The “Dungeon Master” tells you things as you proceed through a dungeon, and you’re free to go about playing while he prattles on, or you can stop and soak in the ambiance.

It only works with smallish clips, though, say, 25 words or less. More than that and the impatient player is past the point of relevance for the imparted information.

I maintain that MMOs aren’t the place for story. Setting, definitely, but the stories really should be coming from the players.

By: SsandmanN

SsandmanN — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 14:31:56 +0000

Which reminds me – perhaps quests can be improved by actually removing the text and adding in cutscenes and actor narrated dialogue.
I tried AION beta yesterday and the animated cutscenes when completing some quests got my attention.
Something like that was implemented in AoC as well.
I think this might be the step in the right direction – you know noone is going to read the quest text. Might as well make a cutscene movie out of it, but this will still be frustrating to the player, as he will lose control of hic character and be forced to endure a cutscene that he is not interested in.
Maybe the best choice would be to have the quest story narrated to him by a voice actor in the background, while the player is free to do what he normally does in the game.

By: West Karana » Daily Blogroll 9/9/09 – Galaxy Express edition

West Karana » Daily Blogroll 9/9/09 – Galaxy Express edition — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 13:09:33 +0000

[...] was one of the fortunate few who went to Seattle’s PAX over the holiday weekend. He had this to say about the games he saw on the show floor: Part of me [...]

By: Borror0

Borror0 — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 05:19:05 +0000

“I’m not really into DDO so that is why I didn’t spend much time investigating it.”
I realized that. I was just amused at the fact that all it got was saying it was to focus, and how contradictory that was. That game has been my game of choice for many years now because it stands out from the rest, and it always had no press. I was shocked when you started to mention it, only to realize it’s the only line it got. That’s all.

By: Borror0

Borror0 — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 05:16:40 +0000

@Wolfshead
“The problem is that many companies are looking at the success of WoW and saying: “Look WoW is successful because they have this quest-based system that tells a story. So let’s tell even better and bigger stories!”.”

I have an hard time believing anyone could be dumb enough to believe that, or anything remotely close to that, and an even harder time believing a professional game designer would. It’s a known fact on the DDO forums that very few players read the stories, let alone remember them after. I even remember one of the developers posting “Wow! You read the story.” after someone made a small comment about it. He was shocked, and understandably so! I personally have been playing for nearly three years now and I don’t even know the story line of the six modules I have seen pass in front of me. I don’t think I have read anything after the first two weeks, actually. And, it’s not any different on other MMOs. I don’t think I have read much in most MMOs I have played or tried past the first few weeks. As a general rule, players don’t want to read text; they want to play. They want loot, and more of it.

If WoW’s quests work, it’s because humans are goal-driven creatures and it’s easier to accomplish an action with a specific goal in mind than if you have to decide yourself what to do, where to go, etc. That’s what makes them fun, not the story line. I would be impressed if even 20% of WoW’s subscribers know what was going on in the last few quests they ran. I mean, if the story line had any relevance or effect, why would they keep using “kill ten rats” goals? Seriously, it’s anything but a good story and I hope everyone realizes that much. It’s the goal that matters, just like it’s because there is a goal that players will harm their gameplay experience on purpose to finish a grind.

We’re talking about basic game design knowledge here. If BioWare or other competitors don’t know that, it is to wonder if they even played MMOs before trying to make their own.

What I think they are thinking is “WoW has that crummy story line for each of its quests. Maybe we can use narrative to immerse gamers in gameplay. As of right now, MMO players are nothing but immersed in the world they explore, what if the missing component is well-implemented story line?”

It’s already less absurd, IMO.

By: Wolfshead

Wolfshead — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 04:13:09 +0000

Well said. I don’t see that AION will be the success that they think it will be. The Asian look and feel is going to cripple it for the western market. I too agree that the Asmodian side was sub-par. I hated it all around.

I’m fed up with Christopher Tolkien as well.

By: Wolfshead

Wolfshead — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 04:08:11 +0000

I think the story focused MMO is at the tipping point of what the average player can tolerate. If I wanted to read a story I’d read any of the thousands of excellent fantasy books out there; I would not resort to playing a MMO.

The problem is that many companies are looking at the success of WoW and saying: “Look WoW is successful because they have this quest-based system that tells a story. So let’s tell even better and bigger stories!”.

That’s not going to work. People will only put up with so much of this. Prepare yourself for a backlash against this kind of MMO.

By: Borror0

Borror0 — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:42:54 +0000

I’m seeing a conflict, in that by being in an online world the story telling becomes much harder if not unimportant because gamers just want to play rather than read but, maybe it can be done effectively?

We’re talking about BioWare, here. While they might not be experienced in MMOs, they still got a renown in the RPG department. If they do it and are willing to invest millions into that, there has to be something that at least seems promising.

Of course, whether the potential playerbase will embrace it or not is another whole new question.

Note that I reserve a lot of reservations: I can’t conceive a way to get it done. But, even if the game is a flop, it will be a lesson learned. The gaming industry is fairly new and hardly learned lessons are valuable. We’ve got still so much to learn. I think SWTOR will be one to follow, for that, whether it fails or succeed.